Tag Archives: PR

Festival Fun: Jane Cable puzzles over how best to publicise a local event

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the-business-of-books-interviewswithjanecableI don’t know if it’s just me, but as a writer I’ve become so locked into digital marketing that asking me to promote something tangible and local leaves me scratching my head.

Although Chindi Authors were always going to run a series of events at this summer’s Festival of Chichester I hadn’t really envisaged joining in. For a start, I would be in the middle of a long distance house move. But since the arts’ editor of the local paper persuaded me to take part it has kind of become my Chichester swan song.

Chindi are running six events in all. We kick off with a crime writers’ panel on 20th June, the next night host a ghost walk around the city, followed by an indie publishing panel on the 22nd and on the 23rd I’m going to talk about how starting my writing career as an indie helped me to win my publishing deal. On Saturday 24th we have two events planned: a creative writing workshop during the day and a wine & words quiz in the evening. The latter came about because our festival home is the function room above Hennings, Chichester’s independent wine merchant.

As ever, children’s author Christopher Joyce is the moving force behind the project. As ever, I was two steps behind him, nodding enthusiastically. As a result of this enthusiasm I find myself taking part in the indie panel, hosting the editing table, and if numbers dictate helping him to run the creative writing workshop. But numbers are the thing – bookings for our events are starting to come in, but they are not all as popular as we hoped.

Some of this is to do with being part of a festival. The upside is being featured in their programme, on their website and across their social media (in theory – the last time they tweeted anything was two weeks ago). The downside is that there are so many great events for people to choose from, so how do we make ours stand out?

FESTIVAL FUN Jane Cable puzzles over how best to publicise a local event

We need to reach local readers and writers – mainly writers – and they are a limited audience. The local papers are being supportive but how else do we make sure they know about our events? Twitter is a massive stage for this sort of thing and although we have lovely Canva graphics to post we need to make sure we are using the correct hashtags. So perhaps social media isn’t the best approach.

Our email newsletter goes out next week and features the events so hopefully that will help increase the numbers. At least the audience is targeted locally and we know they love books.

As a group we decided against leaflets because everyone hates giving them out, but I think this could have been a mistake. We have a poster in the window of Hennings, and I have designed one for my own event which will go into the library and anywhere else I can persuade to take it. Although we are a group and we all promote each others’ events our biggest responsibility is to our own. And from my point of view, local promotion is something I’ve lost the knack for.

Actually, event or not, being visible in the locality of your book, or where you live, is an essential part of the author’s marketing toolkit. People are always so much more interested when they feel they may be able to recognise something of their own lives in your work it’s vital we don’t become so focused on the global horizon we forget our own back yards.

For more information about spoken word events at the Festival of Chichester look here: http://festivalofchichester.co.uk/spoken-word/

 

 

The Business of Books: Bursting the Book Bubble

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the-business-of-books-interviewswithjanecableJane Cable on Bookbub and other promotions

Another You has been on promotion again; partly thanks to Endeavour Press and partly off my own bat. When I heard the price would be dropped to 99p/99c for a good chunk of April in readiness for a Bookbub promotion I thought it would be worthwhile experimenting a bit myself.

I had heard very good things about Kindle Daily Nation (https://kindlenationdaily.com/). Very strong in the US market (where I’m not), they offer a number of sponsorship packages which start from $30 but I opted to splash out on one where Another You would be the only book featured in the mailshot. I’ve often found that the best way to sell my books is to offer a free excerpt and to do this costs $120. I uploaded my details and held my breath. Far from being the impersonal web-based process I expected soon I was receiving friendly emails from the team in New England who designed a great mailshot which showcased my book perfectly.

Did it work? Yes, in that the book shot briefly back up the Amazon.com charts and Endeavour were able to tell me that it sold 26 copies on the day of the promotion. Not nearly enough to pay for it, although more would have sold over the next few days, but overall the increased profile meant the experience was a positive one.

bookpromotionPR publicity

A week or so later Another You was featured on Author Shout’s Cover Wars (http://authorshout.com/cover-wars/). I had applied a few months before so the timing was purely co-incidental and I thought the promotions would bounce off each other well. Any author can apply, but be aware – this competition is far more about social media presence than the cover itself.

I normally work really hard on social media to make the most of every promotion I do and this time I could see it paying off straight away. I shared the link to the voting on the bookish Facebook groups I’m a member of, to my author page and on my personal Facebook account. I tweeted it every day. In Cover Wars you can vote every 24 hours and so many friends and fellow authors rallied around to do this I was knocked out by the support. It was neck and neck until the end, but I realised that the other author vying for top slot was in America so I had a last morning to gather votes before the competition closed. My strategy worked and Another You became Author Shout’s book of the week, featuring on their website and in their own social media. But whether I sold any more copies because of it I can’t really tell.

So on to Bookbub (https://www.bookbub.com/home/). Authors who have been featured rave about it, it isn’t cheap and there is a selection process to go through. Is it worth the hype? The answer is an emphatic yes.

Endeavour booked the promotion for the UK, Canada, Australia and India. It was so effective that within hours I had my first Amazon best-seller label, for 20th century historical romance in Canada. Unlike when the book was available free these were real sales to genuine new customers. A week later the book is still doing pretty well there and in Australia. In the UK it shot up to 400 in the Kindle UK charts and is still selling strongly and in the top 50 for women’s historical fiction.

So, what have I learnt? Strive for the best – save your pennies or beg your publisher and try for a Bookbub slot. And when you do decide on a promotion, harness all your social media resources and work as hard as you can to maximise the impact. Otherwise your time and money are likely to be wasted.

 

 

The Book Publicist EllyDonovanPR talks to Jane Cable

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the-business-of-books-interviewswithjanecableWhat is your book-related job or business?

I am a freelance book publicist carrying out PR campaigns for authors and publishers. I try to obtain reviews, articles and interviews about my clients’ books in newspapers and magazines – and on the internet, the radio or television.  This type of publicity can help boost book sales as well as raising the author’s profile: a good review, an article or an interview in the media is more likely to get a book (and its author) noticed than expensive advertising might do.

 

Nonetheless, book publicity is an extremely competitive and there are no guarantees of success. With approximately 500 new books published every single day in the UK (yes, 500 every day!) it is impossible for every new book to get the media attention it may deserve.

 

Every day, busy journalists and broadcasters are inundated with communications from publishers and authors who are trying to grab their attention with news of forthcoming books. A professional PR campaign may improve an author’s chances of success.  A professional book-publicist knows and understands the media – and knows how to give a book the best possible chance of media coverage in this tough industry.

The Book Publicist EllyDonovanPR talks to Jane Cable …

What is the most rewarding part of it?

It is very satisfying to help authors make the most of their PR opportunities (eg: helping them with their interview technique or advising on their use of social media etc).   New authors soon discover that writing their book is just the first step in a long journey. These days, authors are also expected to be experts at marketing, sales and PR – as well as being good writers. It can be an extremely frustrating and bewildering experience for some novice authors.

 

Assisting authors by carrying out their PR campaigns and then supporting them in the lead-up to publication and during the first few months after is extremely rewarding for me.  It is always a pleasure to hear an author’s reaction on receiving their first good review or when they hear themselves performing well  on the radio or when their TV appearance gets lots of ‘Likes’ on social media. And, naturally, the lovely comments, thank-you cards and testimonials that I receive from authors also mean the world to me.

 

What do you consider to be your major successes?

With so many books being published, only a tiny percentage of books achieve any nationwide publicity at all. This is why it is always a thrill when I see or hear my authors appearing in the national media as a result of my efforts.  Even after all these years in the business, I still get a ‘buzz’ from seeing one of my authors on TV or hearing them interviewed on the radio or reading a good review of their book in a quality newspaper.  However, my successes are not always measured in circulation figures or audience numbers. Sometimes niche coverage in the right publication can be an even more effective way to reach the perfect book-buying audience for a particular book.

 

 

Have you always loved books and what are you reading at the moment?

I’ve always loved reading so studying English literature at University was a pleasure, not a chore. In my professional life, I make a point of reading every one of the many books I promote. (It may surprise you but not all book publicists read the books they promote.) Currently, for my work, I am reading one novel and one memoir written by my clients. In my free time, I am also enjoying Jeremy Paxman’s autobiography, A Life in Questions.

 

Brighton-based EllyDonovanPR has worked in publishing and PR since graduating in 1980. She is a Member of The Publishers’ Publicity Circle; 

and a Partner Member of The Alliance of Independent Authors. 

To find out more about EllyDonovanPR ‘s services for authors and publishers, visit her website ellydonovan.co.uk

You can connect with Elly on social media: 

twitter: @EllyDonovanPR   facebook.com/elly.donovan.7   

Linked-In: Elly Donovan PR  

For further information,  authors & publishers can email: elly@ellydonovan.co.uk

 

 

 

BEST ENDEAVOURS: Jane Cable On Her Digital Publishing Deal. Best Laid Plans 2

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whathappenswhenyougetapublishingdealBEST ENDEAVOURS
Jane Cable’s blog about what happens once that digital publishing deal is in the bag continues.
BEST LAID PLANS 2

 

Way back when, about a hundred or so years ago, I used to work in PR. Great fun it was, except when I had to pick up the phone to some unsuspecting journalist (or anyone else, for that matter) so as I struggled up the greasy pole to the dizzy heights of account management, I needed an assistant.

 

Enter Lisa. A former drama student who was frankly wasted as PA to one of my clients. We worked together; lived near each other (defeating the tube strikes by driving from Wimbledon to the South Bank in my beaten up Ford Fiesta); even escaped the evil pitches we worked for together, to end up in an office above a hairdresser in Kensington with a kindly but chaotic boss who spoiled and cherished us. And we’re still friends twenty five years later.

 

It was Lisa who sent me the original tiny silver seahorse featured in the story, wrapped up in tissue inside a birthday card. And even more surprisingly, this year she sent me an improved model on a chain, together with matching earrings. Because she’d seem them and thought of me. They arrived just days before Endeavour made their offer on the book.

 

So who but Lisa would I turn to for the PR expertise to launch The Seahorse Summer? She did a fantastic job for me on The Cheesemaker’s House, and this time it should be just a fraction easier. Why? Because even in these enlightened days there are a great many newspapers and magazines who won’t touch independently publisher authors.
Jane Cable, publishing, writing

 

To be honest we spent most of our meeting at a mutually convenient motorway service station catching up on family news. For a few years in our twenties we lived in each other’s pockets and while distance and circumstances don’t exactly separate you, they do drive a wedge into your understanding of the everyday aspects of each other’s lives. But when you actually meet, it all falls into place again so easily and trust is instantly restored. I drove away thinking there’s a novel in that somewhere.

 

But as usual I digress. This blog is meant to be about planning a PR campaign. The objective is very much to get reviews. It’s hard to think of a big enough hook to make this a news story, so the book is going to have to stand or fall on its own merits. But stand or fall, it needs to stand out from the crowd. And we did come up with a couple of potential ways to achieve this.

 

The next most important thing is targeting the right journalists and this will be Lisa’s next task. It isn’t as easy as it was in the 80s when you could just phone the magazine and ask. There wasn’t such a thing as email and everything had to be sent snail mail. Or in our case, packing Lisa into a taxi filled with goodies and sending her off to spend the day at ICP towers, chatting to writers and distributing her loot. In 2016 she probably wouldn’t even get past security.

 

 

 

Jane Cable is the author of two independently published romantic suspense novels, The Cheesemaker’s House and The Faerie Tree, and a sporadic contributor to Frost. The Seahorse Summer tells the tale of how two American soldiers born sixty years apart help forty-something Marie Johnson to rebuild her shattered confidence and find new love. Discover more at www.janecable.com.

 

Bowe Bergdahl And Robert Bergdahl Are A Disaster For Obama But He Can Recover

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bergdahls-praises-Allah-at-white-house-obama-not-happy

A lot has been said about the video of Bowe Bergdahl’s father praising Allah at the White House. Frankly, most of it is wrong. Obama was not smiling. Anyone who knows body language and looks at the video will see that, actually, that was a grimace. President was also obviously angry, he knew how much political damage had just been done to him. I don’t know who is advising Obama at the moment, or why he let five terrorists go for one man but whoever is advising him needs to either be fired or given the worst job in politics somewhere far away from the President to make a strong point. American Ambassador of Outer Mongolia or Siberia sounds good.

I don’t know if Obama knew what the Arabic meant at the time, but he knew it was enough to damage him in the eyes of his enemies, most of whom constantly try to make the President out as not a true American.

Robert Bergdahl said at the press conference of his son’s release, “Bism allah alrahman alraheem,” which translates from Arabic to English as “in the name of Allah, the merciful, the compassionate.” It is said before every chapter in the Koran except the 9th (the chapter of the sword). The level of stupidity in quoting the Koran at the White House, even more than ten years after 9/11 is insurmountable. Not to mention insensitive. He may have meant it in a well-meaning way, but it was not that he spoke in Arabic, it was the praise of Allah, the same Allah whose name the pilots flew into the World Trade Centre for. The beard didn’t help. Robert Bergdahl grew it out of ‘solidarity’ for his captured son but we live in a visual world. How things look matter, and it looks bad.

Bowe Bergdahl allegedly left a note saying he wanted to renounce his citizenship before he went AWOL. Then six American soldiers lost their lives trying to rescue him from the Taliban. This is the biggest crisis of Obama’s career and the shades of Homeland (incidentally one of the President’s favourite shows) does not help. The President did not know what Robert Bergdahl was going to say, and he clearly didn’t like what he did say. No man left behind is very American. Even if the man is controversial and not liked within the armed forces because of his desertion.

To rub salt into the wound, the Taliban have released a video of the release of Bowe Bergdahl. Despite all of this, I believe the President can still recover. He just needs to surround himself with the right people.

What do you think?

 

PR or Advertising: So What’s The Difference?

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What's the difference between PR and advertising?Jane Ellison-Bates of Manifest Marketing outlines the difference between PR and advertising – and why that matters

We all make assumptions that certain aspects of our businesses are as clear to others as they are to us.   Whatever trade you are in it’s probably the same; there are some areas of knowledge which are so fundamental that you may assume other people, especially your customers, know what you know. But maybe they don’t.

I have been amazed on a few occasions when business owners have confessed to me that they don’t really understand the difference between advertising and PR.  After more years than I care to reveal in the business, to me it was obvious, but I have come to realise that it’s always worth highlighting with a new client the differences between the two.

My favourite way to explain it is the ‘earned versus owned’ principle.

When you decide to book and pay a publication for space or airtime you therefore ‘own’ it.  Quite simply, this is advertising.  Its principal advantage is that because you are paying for it, within reason you can say what you like.  You get to choose how it looks, where it appears and when it appears.  You are completely in control.  If anything goes wrong or contravenes the T&Cs of your booking then you have the right to complain and seek some form of recompense.  You are essentially blowing your own trumpet, and if you do it well you will convince some, if not all, of the people who see, hear or watch your advert that they should buy your product or service.

PR is a whole different ball game.  This time you need to ‘earn’ your space or fifteen minutes of fame.  You can’t pay a TV station to be featured on the news, or a magazine to run a feature; you have to be offering something that an editor wants to share with the audience.  It’s much, much harder and as such commands a greater value.  This time someone else thinks you’re interesting and is prepared to publicise it over and above other contenders. As a result, as a basic rule of thumb in the marketing industry, PR coverage is valued at three times its advertising equivalent, so, for example, a full page valued at £1000 in the advertising media pack is worth £3000 as editorial.  And you don’t actually pay them for it.  Weird but true.

Editorial coverage for your product, service or story wins you kudos in your field and sets you apart. The downside might be that your story isn’t deemed interesting and doesn’t appear, or that it gets edited in a way you don’t like; possibly even erroneously.  It happens.  Unless it’s actually libellous you are likely to have no comeback.  Alternatively, you may not like the position of the piece; but don’t even think about complaining if you want to have any hope of getting future coverage from them.

And that’s where a PR company comes in handy. Let them get to know your business and they will winkle out the interesting stories, present them well to minimise editing and ‘earn’ you that coverage that you covet.

Lynne Franks Announces Autumn 2013 Programme For Bloom Retreats

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One of Frost’s favourite people and all-round inspirational person, Lynne Franks, author, entrepreneur and women’s empowerment champion, is launching a brand-new series of signature retreats for women at her beautiful home in Deia, Mallorca. BLOOM Retreats offer unique creative and wellbeing experiences in a deeply relaxing atmosphere surrounded by the exquisite local, natural beauty of the Mediterranean coastline.

 lynnefrankshouse lynnefranksretreat

The retreats take place at Lynne Franks’ beautiful property, part of an old monastery, with stunning views overlooking the Mediterranean and the Tramuntana mountains. The site is walking distance of the ancient village of Deia, which has been a hub for many artists, writers and creatives.

 

“I am delighted to be hosting these intimate retreats for women to heal, grow and connect with each other in such a nurturing, feminine space. There has been a tremendous response following each of my BLOOM Retreats over the last few years and it is clearly time to expand our offering and bring in other teachers and specialists,” says Lynne.

 

The BLOOM Detox & Wellness Retreat

16th – 20th September 2013

From €1,125

 

Led by Reiki Master Monika Evans together with 5-Elements nutritionist Ursula Peer, this retreat takes a holistic approach, designed to harmonize body, mind and spirit in a deeply relaxing atmosphere and surrounded by great natural beauty.

 

Your day starts with an (optional) morning meditation followed by a gentle yoga class or mountain walk and a warm breakfast based on 5-Elements Traditional Chinese Medicine Nutrition. During the day sessions are offered to inspire your inner Goddess with exercises and tools you can apply in your busy day-to-day lives for a sense of peace and wellbeing.

 

And there is also plenty of time for rest, relaxing by the pool, soaking in the hot tub, going for walks to the nearby beach and enjoying the magical island of Mallorca. A Reiki healing session, a personalised 5-Elements Nutrition Consultation tailored for your body type and a spa treatment are included in the package. Extra options such as massage and craniosacral therapy can be arranged upon request.

 

The BLOOM Fitness Retreat

22nd – 27th September 2013

From €1,325

 

Renowned fitness consultant and ambassador for Reebok Sarah Maxwell, together with BLOOM Retreats, have created an exclusive women-only 5-day retreat aimed to make you look and feel amazing.

 

During your stay you’ll tone up, lose weight and learn how to access your own inner resources for a calm life while enjoying wonderful food and great natural beauty in a nurturing and supportive environment.

 

Apart from Sarah’s signature fitness group activities we offer private sessions to develop an exercise, relaxation and nutritional programme tailored to your needs and lifestyle. Our delicious, healthy meals are prepared using local, organic ingredients wherever possible to boost flavour and nutritional value.

 

The BLOOM Creative Writing & Nature Walks Retreat

29th September – 4th October

From €950

Discover your true inner voice through a series of exploratory life writing and creative writing sessions and guided walks under the gentle guidance of professional writer, journalist and writing mentor Elaine Kingett.

 

This retreat is not so much about technique, academic ability or previous writing experience, more about delight in the written recording and expression of our individual existence. Each day, after relaxing Mindfulness Mediation, you will take part in a guided walk to fire up your imagination and to discover the supernatural beauty of northern Mallorca, which has inspired writers such as Robert Graves and Anaïs Nin.

 

During the rest of your day, Elaine will lead you through various writing exercises and you’ll also spend time on memoir and autobiographical writing, journaling and letter writing. In the evening you are encouraged to share your work with supportive, like-minded women to learn and grow as a writer.

 

The BLOOM Yoga & Ayurvedic Cooking Retreat

12th – 17th October 2013

From €950 

 

Yoga & Ayurveda are two ancient healing arts with profound wisdom and insight into our human nature, revering life as a sacred system to which every living thing in the universe belongs. Both help us to develop awareness about our bodies and lifestyles guiding us towards balance, strength and wellbeing.

 

You will start the day with meditation and a gentle yoga practice. The postures have a beneficial impact on the whole body, toning muscles, ligaments, joints and nerves, stimulating circulation and helping to release stress and toxins from the body.

 

During the morning there are sessions presenting the principles of ayurveda and how to apply them in your daily life learning what your body needs to bring it back into balance.

 

Cooking is a very grounding practice, connecting us directly with the earth. There will be opportunities for hands on cooking, to learn and enjoy delicious recipes and share our experiences in the kitchen.

 

The BLOOM Inner Artist Retreat

4th – 8th November 2013

From €820

 

Join Frances Baxter and Mariana Alzamora, two renowned artists from Mallorca’s thriving creative community to explore and develop your own inner artist.

 

The retreat combines expert instruction in clay molding, drawing and painting with Lynne’s unique SEED coaching tools to help you lead a creative, abundant and purposeful life. International artists Frances Baxter and Mariana Alzamora will be your guides as you explore how to make clay goddess figures, draw your own self-portrait and paint through the magic of nature. You will get in-depth feedback about your work from Mariana and Frances and be able to share your experience and creative output with the other participants in a safe and nurturing environment.

 

The BLOOM Women’s Creative Leadership Retreat with Lynne Franks

14th-19th November 2013

From €1,690

 

After twenty years of business success, and ten years of developing programmes for women in leadership, Lynne has designed a unique process for the realisation of ones highest potential. In this retreat, she integrates spiritual values with professional insights and personal fulfilment techniques, to create a holistic blueprint for a healthy and successful life.

 

Alongside the enjoyable programme of transformation and change, Lynne will work with each member of the retreat on a one-to-one basis, coaching them personally and professionally to achieve their dreams. She will focus on all areas of life relevant to a modern woman including relationships, career, emotional wealth and physical well-being.

 

Vanessa Bailey & Richard Perryman on Three Days Film | Film interview

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When I interviewed Vanessa Bailey and Richard Perryman about their new film, Three Days, we had so much fun and laughed so hard. Vanessa has co-written and is starring in the age gap romance alongside Richard who is fresh out of drama school. Vanessa is beautiful and talented but doesn’t seem to know it, as is Richard. They are both also wonderful company and building quite a following for their film which will start shooting early next year. To find out more, read on….

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Tell us about your character.

Richard Perryman: ‘I am playing James, a recent graduate, a young guy who does odd jobs. He is flyering for a jazz club and has a care-free lifestyle. He is not really looking for love but just by chance it happens. We were talking about this earlier. It just happens and he is not looking for a long term thing. It just happens to him and he can’t really get away. [laughter]

Vanessa Bailey: [laughing] He can’t really get away! These two characters are not the two people you would expect to see in a relationship. Not just with the age gap, which does sometimes happen, but also with their personalities. She is no a cougar, she is not predatory. She hasn’t been walking around looking for impressionable young leafleters to drag back to her hotel room. He’s not a lad.

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Richard: It’s not a trophy for him.

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Vanessa: It is just a sexual connection between them.

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Richard: Well, not the main one.

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Vanessa: [laughing] No, not the main one. It is about two real people. It is about finding what that connection would be and how it would work out in real life. They are not caricatures. It is not about romantic cliches. If two people really did connect, how would that work. Can it work?

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Richard: Can that relationship last or is it just a fling?

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Vanessa: And we don’t know the answer yet.

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Richard: I think they are probably both going into it thinking it is just a fling. And not expecting to find that they actually fall in love.

Age gap relationships are popular in film at the moment. Why do you think they are popular and what is your favourite?

Vanessa: I really liked the ITV one, Leaving, although I kinda thought they had stolen our thunder because we had written the script before it came out. What appealed to me about that one, and about Three Days, is most of the other films, the age gape in The Graduate isn’t that big. There is only six-years between them because they are playing up and down. So what I really liked about the ITV one was that they had Helen McCrory who is really gorgeous. They were able to make the audience believe. It was a slightly different story and it was about self-improvement. That one would be my favourite because it was anchored in real life. You can recognise it in real life. Whereas with the other ones, they are lovely stories, but they are not real.

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Richard: I have only seen The Graduate. I think with that one he has that relationship thrust upon him. It is much darker. She is more of a cougar and she reels him in. This is more of a chance. It is a more filmic story.

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Vanessa: It is more of a romance. It is not dark in any way. Which is more challenging. There is no gender game. It is more, ‘why has this happened and what should we do with it?’.

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Why do you think there is still a stigma attached to the older women/younger man thing?

Richard: There has been a rise in those type of films. I think there is a stigma attached but it is becoming less and less. There is still that taboo and it is still fine with older men and younger women.

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Vanessa: Again, we were talking about that earlier. I think with the older man and younger women, largely they are a physical manifestation of his success and being sexually attractive to women. It is more of a trophy thing. It is interesting because, as you said, the storyline is really popular. We have 1,300 people following us on Twitter. We have no media, no trailer, nothing really about the film, but I think the story has lots of appeal. We have a lot of different people following us. Younger girls, 17 or 18 years old and older men.

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We had a guy who said when I was in my 20s I had a relationship with a women who was 20 years older than me because it is common. See I am 43.

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Richard: And I am 22.

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Vanessa: Oh my god it has gotten bigger! What is that gap?

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Richard: 21 years.

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Vanessa: Yes, 21 years. That is quite a big gap.

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Richard: It’s not that big.

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Vanessa: Oh, bless you. We can make it work. But I think people are really fascinated by that. I am not going to name names but I had a lot of people say I had this relationship with this women who was 20 years older than me. It is really interesting. It does actually happen but I don’t think film shows that as much as the older guy.

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Another issue with younger men with older women is the fertility issue….

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Vanessa: Yes, I think that is true. It doesn’t work quite as well from a family point of view, biologically the other way around. Maybe some women are at the point when they don’t want to have kids.

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Richard: I think going into that relationship they won’t really think about it and then when they did the pressure would start adding on to it. Like, ‘what do we do?’

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Vanessa: I was talking to some friends about it and they were like, ‘lucky you’ and then I was thinking, no, because in reality when you are an older women it is hard. You have insecurities.

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Richard: Yeah, you were saying to me that when we go out people will be like, ‘Your son is waiting for you’ or ‘Is that your mum?’ or something. Which would be really tough.

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Vanessa: [laughing] There is always a 21-year-old girl around the corner and you are getting older, and you look older, and the point of this, of Three Days, is also when older women are portrayed in films they don’t look their age. They have had all of that plastic surgery and they don’t look their age. I do look my age [she doesn’t] so it is not like, yeah, she is a hot 43 but she looks 33. She is just 43. So there is that whole physical insecurity.

There is also this myth that is spread that men get better looking as they get older but women don’t. It places a lot of pressure on women and it also happens a lot in film. Then when you do get a part it is not a really good part. In this film it is a women in a really good role, which could actually have a lot of significance.

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Vanessa: And that is the great thing about indie film. You have raised a great point actually and that is the good thing about Three Days. There are not the parts out there that actresses my age necessarily want to play. You get typecast in commercials and then you have to wait until you are 75 to play a dowager in Downton Abbey. There is a massive gap in-between. You are just wandering around wondering what you are going to do. A few of us do have a natural look so you are not going to get the barmaid parts or the cougar parts. So I kind of wanted to come up with a part that a lot of women my age would want to play because it is interesting and it is fun. There is a massive gap for older actresses.

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How did you come on-board

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Richard: I didn’t really do anything.

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Vanessa: That is the joy of Twitter. I am going to write a book. Instead of the Joy of Sex I am going to write The Joy of Twitter, and [to Richard] you are probably too young to even know the book. It was out in the 1970s. [to me] You know the book? [Yes, I know the book] See, women know the book.

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So, Twitter, we were looking for someone. I was looking at showreels because I love watching showreels. I saw Richard’s headshot and someone tweeted a link to a short film he was in called Emmeline, which was gorgeous. So I stalked him. I asked him to be in a film with me.

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Richard: I got an email asking me if I wanted to be in the film. We met up for a coffee. Then I wanted to do it. She reeled me in. We were both on the same page in terms of character and what we wanted for the film.

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Vanessa: What clinched it was that halfway through we were talking about the dialogue and how we wanted it to be really natural, and be very real and he said it should be like ‘Before Sunrise’, which is my favourite film. At that point I was really hoping he wanted to be in the film.

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So it was the power of Twitter and short film. And the mocha that I bought him that I then drank.

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Richard: Yeah, I had a latte and she had my mocha.

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Vanessa: Start as you mean to go on.

Tell us about the process of the film so far.

Vanessa: It has been a long time actually, nearly a year. I wrote it. I wrote a really bad script originally. I sent if to Jon Rennie, our director, and basically what he did was he rewrote it from a cinematic point of view. Jon said he liked the story but this is how he thought the physical journey of the film would go. We have beautiful locations we are filming in. Then he gave it back to me to fill in the dialogue. We knew we had Huw onboard who is just phenomenally good.

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The film is quite like Notting Hill on acid. Huw Walters (Cinematographer) and Jon and myself all worked on Bubbles [an excellent short film. See it] Our composer had seen Bubbles and asked us if we had a composer. Then I looked at his credits and I was like, wow. He has worked with the BBC, with Tom Jones, with loads of people.

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Our hair designer, Jason Hall, also asked to come onboard and he had done London Fashion Week. He was also from twitter. He contacted us and asked us if we needed a hair stylist.

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The producer, Sam Smith-Higgins, was following the film since it started on Facebook and she said she would really like to collaborate and asked if we had a producer. She has an entire production company that she is bringing with her. The Executive Producer, Suzie Boudier, has been a constant source of inspiration.

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The great thing about this film is that everyone has come on-board because they really want to make this film rather than just a film. It has been a really long process. I am really excited.

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How did you approach funding.

Vanessa: We will be crowd funding in February. Consolidating everything in March and then we are shooting in April. We are looking at different crowd funding options at the moment.

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Tell us about you.

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Richard: I just graduated from E15 from a contemporary theatre course. I set up my own theatre company with a couple of friends called Antler. We took two shows up to Edinburgh.

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Vanessa: Who have got some amazing reviews. Should I quote some of them? Richard excels in dry humour. That is what it said.

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Richard: We got some lovely reviews. Since then I have done a short film with the same company. I was lucky to be a part of that. And from that I got this. Which is great and exciting.

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Vanessa: I am completely different. No training. I am a teacher. A music specialist whatever that means. I came out of it after I had my children and decided I wanted to be an actress. So I did a lot of background work just to get into the scene and I was lucky to break that rule that you never become an actor after being an extra. I managed to get there. I have managed to blag my way to some good jobs so far.

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You are so self deprecating

Vanessa: Yes I am. But I have no reason to be here. Once I got Spotlight and a DVD I sent it out and Sam [Samantha from Simon & How, out mutual agent] was the first person to give me an audition. I absolutely love it.

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Do you think the age of the actor is dead and you have to be an actorpreneur and do your own projects.

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Richard: I have only ever done my own projects. So I think, yes, you can’t really trust anyone else to do anything for you. You have to do it yourself. If you are lucky enough you will be handed lots of jobs. It is the luck of the draw. If not you have to go out and do it yourself. [to Vanessa] Like you are doing.

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Vanessa: All actors know that it is a really small pool that people fish from. Especially in television. It is hard and it is not going to talent unfortunately. You see people who work regularly who are not good and lots of people who are very talented who don’t get any work. So, yes, I do think you have to be an actorpreneur.

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Richard: I am very bad at selling myself because I am not on Twitter.

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I often lose roles to people who are more famous or someone’s girlfriend.

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Vanessa: Yes, that is frustrating. I can see the other side of that. We all work with people we know because it is better the devil you know.

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Richard: Then that creates those little cliques who work with the same people and you can’t break into it.

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That is why I left Scotland. I had to commute from Glasgow to London because there was the group of Scottish actors who always got work and I could not break into the industry.

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Vanessa: There are a couple of casting directors who fight it. A casting director said to me that he was sick of seeing the same faces in television over and over again.

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And you do. You see the same faces over and over again. We need pioneers who are bringing new faces in and trying to get people seen.

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Richard: But we are a little family. [We all have the same agent. Samantha at Simon & How]

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That’s right.

So is the process to make a short and then a feature film.

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Vanessa: I would love to. I would love to make a feature. Are you playing footsie with me Richard?

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Richard: Yes, I am getting into character.

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Vanessa: Two things with the short film. Firstly, I would like it to get into festivals. But also it is like a calling card. Hopefully people will see this. When we had one of our first meetings with Jon and Huw you could very much see the potential of the film and the ensemble cast. I would love to make a feature film.

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Richard: It has the potential to be a great British film.

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Vanessa: I am such a champion of British film so I would love to make it into a feature.

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What are you shooting on?

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Vanessa: I’m not sure. I have left that to Jon. Not film. Because it is too expensive. We want to do a few different takes on this film and we don’t want to worry about how expensive it would be. I know Jon was talking about filming on mono. So a combination I think.

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What’s next?

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Richard: I just graduated. I am not sure what is next. I am just putting myself out there.

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Vanessa: You are developing….

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Richard: Oh yeah, with my company, Antler, we are constantly developing work. Putting things together and trying out new ideas.

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Vanessa: Everything at the moment is Three Days. Then hopefully after that it will be the festivals. [Vanessa also has a lot of acting work coming up. Including a part in Southcliffe and some short films]

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Thanks Vanessa and Richard.

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Director: Jon Rennie @jon_rennie
Writers: Vanessa Bailey, Jon Rennie @vbaileyactor @jon_rennie
Producer: Sam Smith-Higgins http://www.redbeetlefilms.co.uk/ @SamSmith-Higgins
Executive Producer: Suzie Boudier @Superboooo
Cinematographer: Huw Walters http://vimeo.com/user4428776 @huwcamera
Composer: William Goodchild http://www.williamgoodchild.com/ @WGoodchildMusic
PR: FireflyPR http://www.firefly-pr.com/ @FireflyPR

Hair Design: Jason Hall http://www.jasonhallhairdressing.co.uk/ @Jhhair